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	<title>flds &amp;laquo; WordPress.com Tag Feed</title>
	<link>http://wordpress.com/tag/flds/</link>
	<description>Feed of posts on WordPress.com tagged "flds"</description>
	<pubDate>Mon, 07 Jul 2008 10:02:48 +0000</pubDate>

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<title><![CDATA[Ferraro, Obama, and Mormonism]]></title>
<link>http://bedrockof87.wordpress.com/?p=132</link>
<pubDate>Sun, 06 Jul 2008 20:56:26 +0000</pubDate>
<dc:creator>bedrockof87</dc:creator>
<guid>http://bedrockof87.wordpress.com/?p=132</guid>
<description><![CDATA[My last post, which dealt with misunderstandings about Mormons, made me think back to an article wri]]></description>
<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://bedrockof87.wordpress.com/2008/07/01/many-americans-mistakenly-think-flds-and-lds-are-connected/" target="_blank">My last post</a>, which dealt with misunderstandings about Mormons, made me think back to an article written after Gerarldine Ferraro <a href="http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2008/03/11/politics/horserace/entry3925257.shtml" target="_blank">commented that Obama was "lucky to be who he is" and that the country was "caught up in the concept."</a></p>
<p>In a Newsweek/Washington Post article (<a href="http://newsweek.washingtonpost.com/onfaith/susan_brooks_thistlethwaite/2008/03/youre_wrong_ms_ferraro.html" target="_blank">"You’re Wrong, Ms. Ferraro"</a>), Rev. Susan Brooks Thistlethwaite leaned toward judging that Geraldine Ferraro’s comments about Senator Obama represented the sin of “willful ignorance” rather than simple lack of historical understanding. She strongly argued that we need to honestly look at our nation’s history to overcome a “national case of ‘willful ignorance.'" When I read her passionate argument that Ferraro should extend her vision beyond women’s issues to include African-American issues, that caused me to wonder whether Rev. Thistelthwaite had also weighed in on the Mormon question during this year’s presidential contest.</p>
<p>I found that she had addressed the issue (<a href="http://newsweek.washingtonpost.com/onfaith/susan_brooks_thistlethwaite/2007/05/mainstreaming_the_mormons.html" target="_blank">“Mainstreaming the Mormons”</a>) but discovered statements in the article that leave historically inaccurate impressions of Mormons. One such inaccuracy was the statement:</p>
<blockquote><p>‘Plural marriage’ is still practiced by the more 'fundamentalist' segment of the Mormon church.</p></blockquote>
<p>Plural marriage is, in fact, practiced by offshoots of the Mormon church - churches which have a membership and leadership completely separate from the Mormon church. For many years, the Mormon church itself has had a practice of removing from membership anyone who has more than one spouse.</p>
<p>A second misleading statement in the article is contained in the assertion quoted from Gloria Steinem:</p>
<blockquote><p>If the Mormons had supported the [Equal Rights Amendment], it would have passed. They were enormously powerful in opposing it because there are certain key state legislatures which they control.”</p></blockquote>
<p>A claim as bold as this, even if merely being quoted, should be accompanied by data to allow the reader to judge the accuracy of the claim. Let’s look at the data. In 1979, the deadline year for ratifying the ERA, Mormons represented more than 10% of the population in only two states, Utah and Idaho. Short of resorting to a conspiracy theory, it would be quite a stretch to claim that Mormons controlled any state legislature outside of those two states. The ERA fell eight states short of being ratified. It is, therefore, a historical fantasy to claim that the Mormons could have single-handedly tipped the balance. On the other hand, the largest territory in a map of ERA holdouts was the Southern US. The majority of the twenty states that rejected the ERA are located in the South, representing more than enough states to close the gap needed for ratification. It would be more historically accurate to claim that the Bible Belt, rather than the Mormons, held the balance of power in ERA ratification.</p>
<p>A third misleading statement in the article was the claim that:</p>
<blockquote><p>For American culture as a whole, the advent of the women’s movement along with the freedom the pill gave women to plan their reproductive lives, was socially disconcerting. For the Mormons it was a direct threat to their core value of family.</p></blockquote>
<p>Let's evaluate the simplistic impression left by this statement that Mormons felt threatened by the women's movement and birth control. First, it is instructive to note that the first woman who was elected as a state senator in the United States was Martha Hughes Cannon, a Mormon physician who earned her M.D. degree in 1880. Regarding birth control, let’s turn back again to 1979 and a <a href="http://www.lds.org/ldsorg/v/index.jsp?vgnextoid=2354fccf2b7db010VgnVCM1000004d82620aRCRD&#38;locale=0&#38;sourceId=26cc615b01a6b010VgnVCM1000004d82620a____&#38;hideNav=1" target="_blank">quotation from an article in the Ensign</a>, an official magazine published by the Mormon church:</p>
<blockquote><p>If for certain personal reasons a couple prayerfully decides that having another child immediately is unwise, the method of spacing children - discounting possible medical or physical effects - makes little difference.</p></blockquote>
<p>This statement followed a tradition of leaving reproductive decisions to the discretion of the married couple and doesn't seem to square very well with the notion of a religion threatened by birth control.</p>
<p>Hopefully, the above review provides the reader an improved basis for making informed judgments regarding some of the claims in Rev. Thistlethwaite’s article. However, this discussion does not in any way detract from the need Thistlethwaite expressed for Americans to learn from our collective history in order to help combat oppression and, I would add, to help combat all the offspring of prejudice. Unfortunately, anti-Mormon prejudice was one of the forms of prejudice evident in the current election cycle. One website still features the headline “Vote for Romney is Vote for Satan,” while Mike Huckabee’s official website carried for over 3 months a blog entry stating that Evangelicals must not allow “Mormon garbage” to be elected. Though I felt it was important to correct some of the inaccuracies in Rev. Thistlethwaite’s article, I believe that her prescription for increased historical and cultural knowledge could be quite salutary, whether we’re talking about knowledge related to African-Americans or women or even Mormons.</p>
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<title><![CDATA[FLDS: Does the "F" mean "fashionista"?]]></title>
<link>http://hiscrivener.wordpress.com/?p=300</link>
<pubDate>Sat, 05 Jul 2008 13:48:55 +0000</pubDate>
<dc:creator>hiscrivener</dc:creator>
<guid>http://hiscrivener.wordpress.com/?p=300</guid>
<description><![CDATA[Evidently.
So, look out Tommy Hilfiger, Ralph Lauren and the rest of you budding hopefuls on &#8220;]]></description>
<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://hiscrivener.files.wordpress.com/2008/07/flds-ladies.jpg"><img class="size-full wp-image-301 alignright" src="http://hiscrivener.wordpress.com/files/2008/07/flds-ladies.jpg" alt="" width="320" height="240" /></a>Evidently.</p>
<p>So, look out Tommy Hilfiger, Ralph Lauren and the rest of you budding hopefuls on "Project: Runway"...</p>
<p>Here comes the FLDS ladies from the YFZ Ranch and <a title="Coming to a flea market near you" href="http://www.religionnewsblog.com/21720/flds-sells-cult-fashion-online-ex-member-helps-flds-victims" target="_blank">those hot threads for the fall season</a>.</p>
<p>After the mothers of the Warren Jeffs maverick Mormon compound got their children back - who were once marked 'Property of the State of Texas' - they figured those tablecloth dresses, worn overalls and flashback to the days of the Amish could pay big dividends on the open market.</p>
<p>Who can blame them? With all those high society press photos taken during their legal battles, there's a buzz out there regarding the homegrown high-cotton blends being shilled out from the Ranch. And who knows? With Texas duds made from cowhands on the wild frontier of a Lone Star ranch, there may be an audience out there for things like that.</p>
<p>Maybe, the ladies of the Middle East? They need to be covered from head to toe anyway, why not do it in 'Sunset Orange' or 'Dusky-hued Blue'? There's even a <a title="No, this is not a spoof. " href="http://www.fldsdress.com" target="_blank">Web site</a> for this fast moving product. Step right up, or your Thanksgiving table cover could be the dress of "America's Next Top Model." Man, that's hot.</p>
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<title><![CDATA[Please Understand...]]></title>
<link>http://ldsthoughts.wordpress.com/?p=15</link>
<pubDate>Thu, 03 Jul 2008 22:56:18 +0000</pubDate>
<dc:creator>Rebecca</dc:creator>
<guid>http://ldsthoughts.wordpress.com/?p=15</guid>
<description><![CDATA[[As seen on USAToday.com "Mormons launch campaign to put distance between themselves and polygamists]]></description>
<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><span style="color:#808080;">[As seen on USAToday.com "<span class="inside-head"><a title="Mormons launch campaign to put distance between themselves and polygamists" href="http://www.usatoday.com/news/religion/2008-06-26-mormons-vs-polygamists_N.htm" target="_blank">Mormons launch campaign to put distance between themselves and polygamists</a>"]</span></span></p>
<div id="byLineTag" class="byLine"><strong>By Eric Gorski, Associated Press</strong></div>
<div class="byLine"></div>
<div class="inside-copy">As authorities have investigated a polygamist sect in Texas, Mormon church leaders in Salt Lake City have largely stayed on the sidelines, weighing a response.</div>
<p class="inside-copy">Church officials knew the sect's similar name and practice of polygamy — part of Mormon church life until it was banned more than a century ago — would cause people to confuse the two.</p>
<p class="inside-copy">Now the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, better known as the Mormon church, is starting a public relations campaign that seeks a delicate balance: distinguishing itself from a small, separate group that claims some of the same history while not denigrating someone else's beliefs.</p>
<p class="inside-copy">It's a sensitive issue for the Mormon church, which was persecuted in its early years. The initiative begun Thursday also details how it considers its 19th century practice of polygamy different from present-day practitioners like the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.</p>
<p class="inside-copy">"People have the right to worship as they choose, and we aren't interested in attacking someone else's beliefs," LDS church apostle Quentin Cook said in a statement. "At the same time, we have an obligation to define ourselves rather than be defined by events and incidents that have nothing to do with us."</p>
<p class="inside-copy">"Mormons," he said, "have nothing whatsoever to do with this polygamous sect in Texas."</p>
<p class="inside-copy"><a title="Read the rest..." href="http://www.usatoday.com/news/religion/2008-06-26-mormons-vs-polygamists_N.htm" target="_blank"><em><br />
</em></a></p>
<p class="inside-copy"><a title="Read the rest..." href="http://www.usatoday.com/news/religion/2008-06-26-mormons-vs-polygamists_N.htm" target="_blank"><em>Read the rest of the article...</em></a></p>
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<title><![CDATA[The Distance between Otavalo and Eldorado]]></title>
<link>http://shanecrochets.wordpress.com/?p=36</link>
<pubDate>Thu, 03 Jul 2008 01:31:47 +0000</pubDate>
<dc:creator>shanecrochets</dc:creator>
<guid>http://shanecrochets.wordpress.com/?p=36</guid>
<description><![CDATA[
I was browsing through the Etsy forums earlier today when I noticed this thread about how the women]]></description>
<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><img src="http://image.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/pictures/2008/04/15/mormon460x276.jpg" alt="" width="260" /><br />
I was browsing through the Etsy forums earlier today when I noticed <a href="http://www.etsy.com/forums_thread.php?thread_id=5693765&#38;page=1">this thread</a> about how the women from the Texas sect of the <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fundamentalist_Church_of_Jesus_Christ_of_Latter_Day_Saints">Fundamentalist Church of Latter Day Saints</a> are beginning to sell their handmade clothing to people outside the community <a href="http://fldsdress.com/">on the internet</a>.  As a Salt Lake City Tribune article <a href="http://www.sltrib.com/ci_9737603">explains</a>, this served not only as a way of keeping their children in the traditional clothes that were familiar to them while they were in state custody, but also as a way of bringing in some income, which became necessary as they began to move off of the ranch and have to support themselves non-communally in the mainstream world.  In fact, it's for the latter reason that they're continuing with the venture, now that the children have, in large part, been returned to their mothers.</p>
<p>While I'm a little bit perplexed as to the market they're targeting, I'm looking forward to seeing how this enterprise turns out.  If it's successful, it might be an interesting model for making non-mainstream cultures economically viable in the mainstream, and therefore preserving it.  I'm thinking about this mostly as it applies to indigenous cultures; it makes me think of the Otavalenos of Ecuador.</p>
<p><img src="http://ecuatur.files.wordpress.com/2007/10/otavalenos.jpg" alt="" width="260" /></p>
<p>While cleaning out my bookshelf at my mom's house the other day, I found my journal from last year in Ecuador, and happened upon an entry I had written about what I saw as the erosion of traditional Ecuadorian culture:</p>
<blockquote><p>My father has come to visit, and we were just in Cuenca.  We went to the Musel del Banco Central which had an excellent ethnographic exhibit on the incredible diversity of traditional Ecuadorian culture: the Chagras, the Otavalenos of the Sierra, the Shuar and the Huaroni in the jungle, the Afro-Ecuadorians of Esmeraldas -- to say the least! And it made me kind of sad because more than anything else it made me realize how much as been lost.  That I have lived in Pichincha for 7 months but need to go to a museum to learn about the culture of the Chagras.  But Supermaxis, now these I have experienced firsthand.</p>
<p>Of the 162 kids in the school where I teach, I know of 2 who speak Quechua -- although many have indigenous names: Quishpe, Gualotuna, Chugchilan, Pachacama, Tipan, Llumiguoma, Paucar, etc.  There is no pride in indigenous heritage; the kids use "indigena" to say idiot, basically.  Their uniform is jeans, sweaters, and shiny black shoes; they learn English but not Quechua; their school books tell stories portraying indigenous peoples as backwards, ignorant, dumb.  Throughout the country, typical styles of dress have been replaced by halter tops and stretch jeans.  Those who can shop at supermarkets identical to their North American counterparts; those who can't aspire to.</p>
<p>My dad said, it's too bad that there isn't a way to integrate people into the modern economy, let them rise out of poverty, etc., but still allow them to maintain their culture.  Isn't there though? Take the Otavalenos, the most prosperous indigenous community in Ecuador, and the one -- at least in the Sierra -- that has best held onto its roots.  The other day my friend Eva was flying out to Bolivia, so I was waiting for her at Quito's Mariscal Sucre airport to say goodbye.  I stood outside the international departures section for about 15 minutes and in that time two separate Otavaleno families showed up and went inside to fly away.  The arrived in new, comfortable-looking cars, they were well-dressed and about to board international flights, but the men wore their hair in long braids under traditional felt hats, the women wore the traditional frilly blouses and gold necklaces, and the snatches of conversation I overheard were most definitely not in Spanish.  They obviously were very connected to and proud of their heritage, yet they were certainly not living in poverty; on the contrary! On the other hand, the blue-jeans wearing children I work with would never dream of stepping on an airplane, let alone one bound for a destination outside the country.</p>
<p>Oh globalization! It is strange to be a North American and watch a country be so devoured by our cultural imperialism.  I wish the Otavalenos were the norm, not just a notable exception....</p></blockquote>
<p>Anyway, it seems to me that what the Otavalenos have done successfully, and what the FLDS must be hoping to do, is market their unique culture to a more mainstream audience.  I think that this is one of the best ways to preserve a culture -- to make it economically viable, cynical though that my sound.  Although I'm not sure how I feel about the preservation of such an oppressive and repressive culture, if this FDLS experiment is successful, it will definitely be an interesting model for ethnographic marketing!</p>
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<title><![CDATA[WTF...LDS?]]></title>
<link>http://hiscrivener.wordpress.com/?p=285</link>
<pubDate>Thu, 03 Jul 2008 01:03:35 +0000</pubDate>
<dc:creator>hiscrivener</dc:creator>
<guid>http://hiscrivener.wordpress.com/?p=285</guid>
<description><![CDATA[Sorry, typo. I meant, WT&#8230;FLDS. Yeah, that&#8217;s it?! Oh, whatever.
Have you seen this story?]]></description>
<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sorry, typo. I meant, WT...<strong>FLDS</strong>. Yeah, that's it?! Oh, whatever.<a href="http://hiscrivener.files.wordpress.com/2008/07/the-letter-f1.jpg"><img class="alignright size-medium wp-image-287" src="http://hiscrivener.wordpress.com/files/2008/07/the-letter-f1.jpg?w=300" alt="" width="300" height="300" /></a></p>
<p><a title="Mormons get a face lift, kinda. " href="http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080627/NEWS07/806270387/1009" target="_blank">Have you seen this story</a>? Mine is from the <em>Detroit Free Press</em>, but I'm sure it's found in the <em>Salt Lake City Tribune</em>, somewhere.</p>
<p>Anywhoo, the [GASP] Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, or the Mormons [WHEW] has called a doctor... a SPIN DOCTOR. They have seen the countless stories in the news about FLDS, the polygamist sect that fancied young girls in Eldorado, Texas. Then again, who hasn't seen these stories.</p>
<p><a title="Funny. MORON is in the name. Hmmm." href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Angel_Moroni" target="_blank">Moroni</a> <span style="text-decoration:line-through;">flapped his wings</span>, er, don't that kind of angel... blew his bugel and the alarm sounded in the hills of Utah. The temple in Salt Lake is fed up with retrieving calls in their voice mail about <a title="Take your pick in here" href="http://hiscrivener.wordpress.com/index.php?s=flds" target="_blank">Warren Jeffs</a> and his affinity for mid-life crises. So, they are speaking out... and not a moment too soon:</p>
<blockquote><p>"People have the right to worship as they choose, and we aren't interested in attacking someone else's beliefs," said LDS church apostle Quentin Cook. "At the same time, we have an obligation to define ourselves, rather than be defined by events and incidents that have nothing to do with us... Mormons have nothing whatsoever to do with this polygamous sect in Texas."</p></blockquote>
<p>Way to set yourself apart from the netherdudes in the Lone Star State, Q. You think shacking up with little girls, making them little mommies and trading them in for a younger model is um, "WORSHIP"?!</p>
<p>Music and song touching the heart of God. THAT'S worship! Even the melodious voices of that heavenly choir and majestic organ you kids are rocking in Salt Lake is worship. What these iniquitous vagabonds did in Texas is called CRIMINAL.</p>
<p>Oh, and if you are truly concerned about defining yourself with this clammy-handed, limp-wristed shot over the bow, try playing Wheel of Fortune and get the media to flip over the first consonant there.</p>
<p>After all, when America reads <a title="Now, that's impressive" href="http://news.google.com/news?hl=en&#38;tab=wn&#38;ned=us&#38;q=flds&#38;ie=UTF-8" target="_blank">those stories</a> or this one, they only have one question, "What the eff?!"</p>
<p>Think about it, Apostle!</p>
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<title><![CDATA[The polygamist look is IN! FLDS women launch their own clothing line ]]></title>
<link>http://miketomlinson.wordpress.com/?p=379</link>
<pubDate>Wed, 02 Jul 2008 20:08:55 +0000</pubDate>
<dc:creator>mt330404</dc:creator>
<guid>http://miketomlinson.wordpress.com/?p=379</guid>
<description><![CDATA[

By Brooke Adams
The Salt Lake Tribune
June 30, 2008
Click here for the original article
 
  
ELDOR]]></description>
<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><span><span><!--subtitle--><!--byline--></span></span></p>
<p><!--date--></p>
<div class="articleDate"><span class="articleByline">By Brooke Adams<br />
The Salt Lake Tribune<br />
</span>June 30, 2008<br />
<a href="http://www.sltrib.com/ci_9737603" target="_blank">Click here for the original article</a><br />
<strong> </strong></div>
<p><strong>  </strong></p>
<div class="articleBody"><img class="alignleft" src="http://www.timesonline.co.uk/multimedia/archive/00361/angelo_185x185_361722a.jpg" alt="flds" /><span><span>ELDORADO, Texas - A new clothing brand may be born out of the Texas raid on a polygamous sect.<br />
<strong> </strong><br />
</span></span></div>
<div class="articleBody"><span><span>FLDS women for the first time are offering their handmade, distinctive style of children's clothes to the public through the Web site <a href="http://fldsdress.com/" target="_BLANK">fldsdress.com</a>. </span></span></div>
<p><strong> </strong></p>
<div class="articleBody">Launched initially to provide Texas authorities with clothing for FLDS children in custody, the online store now is aimed at helping their mothers earn a living.</div>
<p><strong> </strong></p>
<div class="articleBody">The venture, which has already drawn queries from throughout the U.S., is banking on interest in modest clothes, curiosity and charity to be a success.</div>
<p><strong> </strong></p>
<div class="articleBody">"We don't know what to expect on demand but we have had a flood of interest," said Maggie Jessop, a member of the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints. "Our motive is not to flaunt ourselves or our religion before the world. We have to make a living the same as everyone does."</div>
<p><strong> </strong></p>
<div class="articleBody"><a href="http://www.sltrib.com/ci_9737603" target="_blank">Click here for the full story</a></div>
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<title><![CDATA[The hottest new fashion trend?]]></title>
<link>http://jordansays.wordpress.com/?p=254</link>
<pubDate>Wed, 02 Jul 2008 14:28:44 +0000</pubDate>
<dc:creator>Jordan</dc:creator>
<guid>http://jordansays.wordpress.com/?p=254</guid>
<description><![CDATA[In case you&#8217;re wondering what&#8217;s on my birthday wishlisht, click here.
Whiskey Tango Foxt]]></description>
<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In case you're wondering what's on my birthday wishlisht, click <a href="http://http://fldsdress.com/index.php" target="_blank">here</a>.</p>
<p>Whiskey Tango Foxtrot? These FLDS nujobs are peddling their wares on the interwebs now? Next thing you know, you'll be able to find your next sister-wife on a website.</p>
<p>I can picture it now:</p>
<p>"Sarah is a precious 12-year-old right out of Little House on the Prairie. If you've always wanted a "half-pint" off your own, tell your husband to whip out his credit card and buy his next wife before another pedo snatches her up!"</p>
<p>Ok, alleged pedo. Whatever.</p>
<p>Seriosuly, who in their right and sound mind would actually purposely purchase one of these garments? Not only are they hideous, but basically everything on the website is 100% polyester. So not only do they have to suffer the indignity of life as one of many wives and essentially being a baby mill, but they have to wear fabric that doesn't breathe? What kind of monsters ARE those FLDS people?</p>
<p>No wonder these ladies look so miserable:<br />
<a href="http://jordansays.files.wordpress.com/2008/07/flds-ladies1.jpg"><img class="alignnone size-medium wp-image-252" src="http://jordansays.wordpress.com/files/2008/07/flds-ladies1.jpg?w=181" alt="" width="181" height="300" /></a></p>
<p>Come to think of it, my birthday is in the neighborhood of Halloween. This might make a really great costume. Now I just need someone to teach me how to make one of these breathtaking and intricate braids:</p>
<p><a href="http://jordansays.files.wordpress.com/2008/07/mormon-hair.jpg"><img class="alignnone size-medium wp-image-253" src="http://jordansays.wordpress.com/files/2008/07/mormon-hair.jpg?w=225" alt="" width="225" height="300" /></a></p>
<p>Hot!</p>
<p>If you'd like more on the backstory as to why these women started selling this stuff online, click <a href="http://www.sltrib.com/ci_9737603">here</a>. I'm sure some of you more sensitive types will feel bad for them. Clearly, I'm not one of those people...</p>
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<title><![CDATA[The Infamous Prairie Dresses - for girls]]></title>
<link>http://veiledglory.wordpress.com/?p=715</link>
<pubDate>Wed, 02 Jul 2008 12:13:16 +0000</pubDate>
<dc:creator>cbrunette</dc:creator>
<guid>http://veiledglory.wordpress.com/?p=715</guid>
<description><![CDATA[Wouldn&#8217;t you know it&#8230;I am sick! Knew that was coming from all the craziness at work. A d]]></description>
<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wouldn't you know it...I am sick! Knew that was coming from all the craziness at work. A day of rest at home....ahhh.</p>
<p>Lookey what I found: <a href="http://fldsdress.com/index.php">FLDS Dress</a>. For kids.</p>
<p>They sell the dresses up to "teen" sizes but no further. Maybe grown women will demand adult sizes. You know, all those closet prairie dress wearers. Wink, wink, nudge, nudge.</p>
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<title><![CDATA[Many Americans Mistakenly Think FLDS and LDS are Connected]]></title>
<link>http://bedrockof87.wordpress.com/?p=131</link>
<pubDate>Wed, 02 Jul 2008 04:03:41 +0000</pubDate>
<dc:creator>bedrockof87</dc:creator>
<guid>http://bedrockof87.wordpress.com/?p=131</guid>
<description><![CDATA[The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (LDS), a worldwide church that is headquartered in S]]></description>
<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (LDS), a worldwide church that is headquartered in Salt Lake City and has over <a href="http://newsroom.lds.org/ldsnewsroom/eng/statistical-information" target="_blank">13 million members</a>, has <a href="http://newsroom.lds.org/ldsnewsroom/eng/news-releases-stories/church-seeks-to-address-public-confusion-over-texas-polygamy-group" target="_blank">released the results of a survey</a> that indicate Americans confuse the FLDS Church (Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints) with the LDS Church.</p>
<ul>
<li>36% mistakenly believe the YFZ Ranch is part of the LDS Church</li>
<li>6% mistakenly said that the FLDS and LDS are partly related</li>
<li>29% said they were not sure of the relationship between the FLDS Church and LDS Church</li>
<li>Only 29% correctly responded that the two groups are not connected at all</li>
</ul>
<p>I had mistakenly believed that most Americans had figured out that the FLDS Church and the LDS Church are completely separate churches and have no more relationship between each other than, for example, the Lutheran Church and the Catholic Church.</p>
<p>Even though 91% of those surveyed had heard about the YFZ Ranch, most respondents could not correctly identify the religious affiliation of the people living at the YFZ Ranch.</p>
<ul>
<li>30% identified the affiliation as The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, LDS, or Mormon</li>
<li>44% were unsure</li>
<li>6% said Mormon fundamentalists</li>
<li>14% said FLDS</li>
</ul>
<p>Elder Quentin L. Cook, an LDS apostle, said:</p>
<blockquote><p>We'd much rather be talking about who we are than who we aren't. While many news reporters have been careful to distinguish between our church and this small Texas group, it is clear the confusion still remains.</p></blockquote>
<p>Below is an example of one of several videos the LDS Church has posted on You Tube in an effort to define what the LDS Church is by looking at the lives of church members living in Texas.</p>
<p><span style='text-align:center; display: block;'><object width='425' height='350'><param name='movie' value='http://www.youtube.com/v/6giBfS5VyeM'></param><param name='wmode' value='transparent'></param><embed src='http://www.youtube.com/v/6giBfS5VyeM&rel=0' type='application/x-shockwave-flash' wmode='transparent' width='425' height='350'></embed></object></span></p>
<p>It's pretty clear that there is no lack of confusion right now about both the FLDS and the LDS. Many of my previous posts have documented misrepresentations of and misunderstandings about the FLDS. It seems that, even with all the coverage of the events surrounding the FLDS Church, there has been a good deal of misunderstanding about the LDS Church as well.</p>
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<title><![CDATA[Holy Shit - and I'm back]]></title>
<link>http://politicalmpressions.wordpress.com/?p=163</link>
<pubDate>Tue, 01 Jul 2008 21:23:44 +0000</pubDate>
<dc:creator>Meredith</dc:creator>
<guid>http://politicalmpressions.wordpress.com/?p=163</guid>
<description><![CDATA[I just returned from a week-long jaunt to Vegas, newly married and found this on my television scree]]></description>
<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I just returned from a week-long jaunt to Vegas, newly married and found this on my television screen:</p>
<p><img class="alignleft" src="http://fldsdress.com/order/images/teen_princess_dress.jpg" alt="flds dress" width="102" height="181" />This is the "Teen Princess Dress" from the <a title="flds dress" href="http://fldsdress.com/" target="_blank">FLDS Dress</a> website. That's right. They're selling their freaky 19th-century cult garb. Wow.<img class="alignright" src="http://www.zubisrises.com/media/images/garb/women/Chador.jpg" alt="chador" width="60" height="154" /></p>
<p>I mean, part of me wants to buy one. I already have an Islamic chador my friend got me from a market in the UAE and a beautifully embroidered Indian wedding sari I used as window drapery. I suppose I could start a collection of religious garb, but that would be creepy. Still, the idea of wearing one of these FLDS dresses for Halloween is almost irresistible. However, no dreams of once again taking first prize in the costume contest will convince me to place an order (last year, I took home the gold by dressing up as Chris Farley in the Lunch-Lady SNL sketch. I rocked it hard).</p>
<p>First of all, the smallest size they have is 8A. Now, I have no idea how freaky-cult 8A compares to the Real World size 8. Secondly, size 8A runs a cool $72.53. I don't think if there is a god that it would want anyone to spend that kind of dough just to look chaste. Not with these gas prices. I mean, buy a sheet, cut a hole in the middle for your head and put a belt around it, for chrissakes.</p>
<p>Lastly, and most obvious, I take voting with the dollar seriously and will not support an intolerant, closed cult that practices sexual abuse and tax evasion (among many other crimes, I'm sure), refuses to educate the female members properly, is secretive and follows the late psychopath Joseph Smith. Not for any Halloween prize even if it's really, really awesome.</p>
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<title><![CDATA[FLDS Fashion ]]></title>
<link>http://mouemagazine.wordpress.com/?p=1528</link>
<pubDate>Tue, 01 Jul 2008 18:49:59 +0000</pubDate>
<dc:creator>Brandy Betz</dc:creator>
<guid>http://mouemagazine.wordpress.com/?p=1528</guid>
<description><![CDATA[Many thoughts crossed my mind while I was watching the FLDS custody mess unfold on television. ]]></description>
<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Many thoughts crossed my mind while I was watching the FLDS custody mess unfold on television. "I wonder where I could get a dress like that" was never one of those thoughts. But if compound chic seems right up your alley, never fear. The FLDS is selling their fashions online. <a href="http://www.fldsdress.com/index.php">Seriously</a>. To add insult to visual injury, the garments are really over priced. One of those poof sleeved prairie dresses sells for over $70.00.</p>
<p>From their <a href="http://www.fldsdress.com/about.php">About Us</a> page:</p>
<p style="padding-left:30px;">This site is dedicated to provide children with clothing that  meets the FLDS standards for modesty<br />
and neatness. Our commitment is to offer quality,   handmade,  modest, affordable clothing.<br />
Each piece is made with joy and care.</p>
<p>If the movie Children of the Corn freaked you out, I don't recommend looking at the child models on the site for too long.</p>
<p><iframe src='http://digg.com/api/diggthis.php?u=http%3A%2F%2Fdigg.com%2Farts_culture%2FFLDS_Fashion' height='82' width='55' frameborder='0' scrolling='no' style='float: right; margin-left: 10px; margin-bottom: 5px; padding: 4px 0 2px 4px; background: #fff;'></iframe></p>
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<title><![CDATA[Dull threads for budding cultists]]></title>
<link>http://parallelnormal.com/?p=538</link>
<pubDate>Tue, 01 Jul 2008 17:18:13 +0000</pubDate>
<dc:creator>Mark Baard</dc:creator>
<guid>http://parallelnormal.com/?p=538</guid>
<description><![CDATA[The Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints reports a &#8220;flood of interest]]></description>
<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><em>The <span><span>Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints reports a <a href="http://origin.sltrib.com/news/ci_9737603">"flood of interest"</a> in its Plain Jane threads. I've got my eye on the lucky Mormon underwear (right). I imagine there will be a few orders from those with a pervy interest (role-players) in the product. But the FLDS clothes for sale are for kids only. -- mb</span></span></em><img class="alignright" src="http://www.fldsdress.com/order/images/boys_underwear.jpg" alt="" /><span><span> </span></span></p>
<blockquote><p><a href="http://www.fldsdress.com/about.php">FLDS Dress</a><br />
And they did impart of their substance, every man according to that<br />
which he had, to the poor, and the needy, and the sick, and the<br />
afflicted; and they did not wear costly apparel,<br />
yet they were neat and comely.  Alma 1:27</p></blockquote>
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<title><![CDATA[The Book of Mormon, and the LDS and FLDS Situation]]></title>
<link>http://bookofmormonnotes.wordpress.com/?p=45</link>
<pubDate>Mon, 30 Jun 2008 00:56:30 +0000</pubDate>
<dc:creator>grego</dc:creator>
<guid>http://bookofmormonnotes.wordpress.com/?p=45</guid>
<description><![CDATA[The Book of Mormon, and The LDS and FLDS Situation
In the Book of Mormon, we read of apostate groups]]></description>
<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The Book of Mormon, and The LDS and FLDS Situation</p>
<p>In the Book of Mormon, we read of apostate groups, such as: the Amulonites, the Amalekites, the Zoramites, the Ammonihahites.  The apostates living among the Lamanites had become much more hard-hearted than the Lamanites themselves.  In fact, in the great Anti-Nephi-Lehi conversion, only one apostate living among them converted to the Church (Alma 23:14).  Among the Zoramites, however, there were many who came back, just like in Ammonihah.  It seems that while many, especially the leaders, wouldn't let go, followers did.  </p>
<p>The greatest apostate splinter group, however, was the Lamanites.  (Ok, so technically maybe Laman and Lemuel never did truly believe--not that there wasn't proof enough for them to do so...)  For most of the history, the Lamanites were a large group, and the Nephites were small; the Lamanites were monogamous, and the Nephites so most of the time.  The Lamanites had been taught false traditions about the Nephites, and hated them.  The Nephites, however, had tried many times to convert the Lamanites, but to no avail.  It was when Ammon and his brothers and brethren decided to go to the Lamanites that the conversions came.  Interestingly, their friends told them that instead of going to preach the gospel to them, it would be best to remember the differences, remember the Lamanites' sins, and take this opportune moment to destroy the yucky Lamanites (Alma 26).  Instead, Ammon and his brothers and brethren went, and converted many.  It wasn't easy, but it happened.  </p>
<p>(From what I have gathered, I have no doubt that the FLDS (Fundamentalists) aren't God's church; not just because I believe the LDS Church is, but for other reasons, too.  I also have few sympathies for many of the FLDS leaders I've read about.  Not that I've seen lots of court cases won against them, either...)  </p>
<p>Perhaps the FLDS--leaders? members? hate or dislike the LDS Church, and maybe it's even taught to the members.  Or maybe it's just part of the story, so to say.  I guess that's the worse case scenario, like with the Lamanites.  I don't know.  </p>
<p>The LDS Church has recently shown goodwill to victims all over the world, particularly Christians in the southern USA and Muslims.  </p>
<p>I wondered how far that goodwill would extend?  Would it cover some FLDS, too?  </p>
<p>From http://newsroom.lds.org/ldsnewsroom/eng/news-releases-stories/church-seeks-to-address-public-confusion-over-texas-polygamy-group comes this quote:  </p>
<p>"People have the right to worship as they choose, and we aren't interested in attacking someone else's beliefs," Elder Cook said. "At the same time, we have an obligation to define ourselves rather than be defined by events and incidents that have nothing to do with us. It's obvious we need to do more to help people understand the enormous differences that exist between our Church which is a global faith and these small polygamous groups." </p>
<p>I'm finally glad the Church came out to say something like this (the whole article).  In one way, the first part of the quote and much of the article is much better than all that has been said before.  </p>
<p>However, I have a few problems:<br />
1. Does "global faith" have anything to do with truthfulness?<br />
2. Does "small (polygamous) group" have anything to do with truthfulness?<br />
I sure hope not, for either.  Otherwise, a little over 100 years the Catholic Church was true, and the LDS Church wasn't!  </p>
<p>I hope that's not what he meant, right?  </p>
<p>3. Is all that time, effort, and money to make people--the "hoi polloi"--"understand [we aren't the same]", really worth it and the best use of resources?<br />
4. Was this the best message to play loudly at the time?  </p>
<p>"We are not like them; we are just like you!" seems to be the message the Church wants to put out to everyone, with all the comments and the "normal" and "famous" people who are "achievers" appearing in the new videos about Texas members.  It seems the Church is saying, "See, we have become more mainstream and acceptable, and we must use this new power to get you to join..."  But is that true?  It really makes me wonder what the Church's vision is, and how the leaders and workers want the LDS Church to be seen in the media, and in the eyes of the people.  I wonder if showing videos of poor people who have joined the Church, and how it has helped them, might be a better way to fish?  I can't help but think there might more converts that way...  </p>
<p>In all of this, I have been waiting--like I waited during the great mess of Waco--for the Church to come out with another public statement; one containing words and phrases like "freedom of religion", "governmental interference", "habeas corpus"; or even to send money to the FLDS legal defense fund, or to take care of those who need help.  </p>
<p>(Talk about what great PR that would be, eh?!  Imagine LDS leaders holding a huge check for $10,000 - $100,000 and saying--at perhaps the *only* time many FLDS would be able to hear it, not locked up in their compounds avoiding non-FLDS according to their "commandments":  "Even though we, The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, commonly known as the Mormons or LDS, believe that the FLDS are a (polygamy-living) apostate group that broke off from us long ago and is not connected to us, we are concerned with what they are going through; (maybe a political statement such as this could have been in here, too: that, due to nothing more than religious bigotry and a falsehood, children were seized from their parents, against Constitutional rights; in our past, we have had similar experiences; ) and we would like to tell them that others outside of their group are concerned about them (or maybe even "love them") and their children's welfare, and present them with this check for $100,000 to use towards getting the children back and getting them back on their feet...")  </p>
<p>It looks like I'll have to wait as long as I had to for the Waco statement--forever.  </p>
<p>The LDS Church has been--deservedly--crying foul for over a century for multiple harsh injustices condoned, allowed, and committed by local, state, and federal governments.  We knew what it was like to be persecuted for polygamy, be falsely accused, have families threatened and broken up and fathers arrested and thrown in prison, etc.  So it makes me think twice and shudder a little when I see things like this happen (Branch Davidians, FLDS) without LDS Church comment and statement.  If we say nothing when things like this happen, how much of a right do we have to complain about yesteryears?  And what about when it happens (and it will) in the future?  Will we truly have cause to be surprised if no one says anything, if no one speaks out, if no one dares do anything?  </p>
<p>Perhaps, though, the LDS Church's response will be something similar to its response to Waco.  </p>
<p>President Hinckley invited US Attorney General Janet Reno to attend the Freedom Fesitval in Provo, Utah--as his personal guest, I think.  He even gave the prayer.  (First time I'd ever heard a prophet pray?)  No doubt this was a display--and more importantly--teaching evening for the person supposedly in charge of attacking the Davidians at Waco:  "'Without acknowledgment of Deity, without recognition of the Almighty as the ruling power of the universe, the all-important element of personal and national accountability shrinks and dies,' said President Hinckley at the annual Freedom Festival in Provo, Utah, attended by more than 24,000 people on 29 June 1997 in Brigham Young University's Marriott Center.' ( http://www.lds.org/ldsorg/v/index.jsp?vgnextoid=2354fccf2b7db010VgnVCM1000004d82620aRCRD&#38;locale=0&#38;sourceId=956e57b60090c010VgnVCM1000004d82620a____&#38;hideNav=1 )</p>
<p>I don't doubt that the Brethren are doing the best they know and can, and that God is guiding them.  (Goodness knows, I have a hard enough time with just my family...)  In fact, I think it's with an eye for our safety that this type of approach is being taken.  Is it because the LDS Church is still not quite out of the wilderness and can't be open about certain things?  But if not, why does it seem like we are thumping our chests in moments like these, with the FLDS?  Or, perhaps Church members are slowing the leaders down and holding them back.  Perhaps they would like to do differently, but feel it's best to hold back at the current time.  There's reason that Jesus Christ didn't start preaching until he was 30...  Remember that many of those apostate rejoinings in the Book of Mormon also resulted in bloodshed and war.  </p>
<p>Just that one day, I hope it all gets better, and the LDS Church becomes more like Ammon and his brothers and brethren, and less like their friends.  </p>
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<title><![CDATA[CPS Advisory Committee Member Said Service Plans Abuse Parents]]></title>
<link>http://bedrockof87.wordpress.com/?p=129</link>
<pubDate>Sun, 29 Jun 2008 22:40:07 +0000</pubDate>
<dc:creator>bedrockof87</dc:creator>
<guid>http://bedrockof87.wordpress.com/?p=129</guid>
<description><![CDATA[State of Texas 49, King George 28
49. An Advisory Committee Memory appointed by Governor Perry to ad]]></description>
<content:encoded><![CDATA[<h2><strong><strong><strong><strong><a href="http://bedrockof87.wordpress.com/2008/05/06/state_of_texas_vs_king_george/" target="_blank">State of Texas 49, King George 28</a></strong></strong></strong></strong></h2>
<p><strong>49. An Advisory Committee Memory <a href="http://www.thsc.org/cle.asp" target="_blank">appointed by Governor Perry</a> to advise the Texas Department of Family and Protective Services said  the approach outlined in the service plans represents an abuse of the FLDS parents.</strong></p>
<p><a href="http://www.kxan.com/Global/story.asp?S=8344390" target="_blank">KXAN reported</a> that advisory committee member Tim Lambert said:</p>
<blockquote><p>They say, "OK, we've got the kids for a year. Now, you gotta do what we tell you to do. We don't know what that is, and that might change as we go along." Now, I would submit to you that is abuse. That is parental abuse by CPS.</p></blockquote>
<p>I've previously docmented instances in which CPS actions caused FLDS children to suffer (<a href="http://bedrockof87.wordpress.com/2008/06/27/flds-child-dehydrated-and-malnourished-while-in-state-care/" target="_blank">FLDS child dehydrated and manourished</a>; <a href="http://bedrockof87.wordpress.com/2008/06/20/young-flds-kids-who-suffered-in-state-care/" target="_blank">FLDS kids ate poorly and slept poorly</a>; <a href="../2008/06/10/cps-didnt-allow-flds-kid-with-104-degree-fever-to-be-with-mom/" target="_blank">FLDS kid with 104 degree fever not allowed to be with mom</a>; <a href="../2008/05/27/flds-child-crying-himself-to-sleep/" target="_blank">FLDS kid cyring himself to sleep</a>). Now we can observe that CPS actions also unnecessarily caused suffering of the FLDS parents. CPS being let loose on the FLDS community is looking more and more akin to <a href="http://bedrockof87.wordpress.com/2008/05/13/when-cps-is-let-loose-in-the-flds-china-shop/" target="_blank">a bull being let loose in a china shop</a>.</p>
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<title><![CDATA[Chess or Polygamy]]></title>
<link>http://saol.wordpress.com/2008/06/28/chess-or-polygamy/</link>
<pubDate>Sat, 28 Jun 2008 20:43:40 +0000</pubDate>
<dc:creator>saoandco</dc:creator>
<guid>http://saol.wordpress.com/2008/06/28/chess-or-polygamy/</guid>
<description><![CDATA[Abu Bakar Embong married a fourth wife after Shariah Court approved his application. He has three wi]]></description>
<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><span style="font-size:10pt;">Abu Bakar Embong married a fourth wife after Shariah Court approved his application. He has three wives and 25 children. Abu Bakar 54 and his new wife 29.</span></p>
<p><span style="font-size:10pt;">Tom Green well known polygamist in Utah sentenced to serve five concurrent terms of five years for four counts of bigamy and one of failing to pay child support, BBC <a href="http://newsroom.lds.org/ldsnewsroom/eng/commentary/tom-green-polygamist-coverage">reported</a>. He has five wives and 25 children. His wife Linda was 13 when he married her.</span></p>
<p><span style="font-size:10pt;">Do you know how surprisingly polygamists reason out the practice? Read <a title="polygamy" href="http://www.divinecaroline.com/article/22324/48532">this</a>. </span></p>
<p><span style="font-size:10pt;">There are others such as polygymy (a man with more than one wife), polyandry (one woman having more than one husband) and polygamy (one person having many wives and many husbands at one time). </span></p>
<p><span style="font-size:10pt;">Salt Lake City based Church of Jesus Christ of latter of Saints and famous polygamous FLDS practice Mormonism, where there are many wives and husbands you can count on. This is illegal in America. </span></p>
<p><span style="font-size:10pt;">Well, although Islam permits polygamy (not polyandry) it is uncommon for a Malaysian and other Muslims worldwide to have more than one wife.</span></p>
<p><span style="font-size:10pt;">Oh my, nowadays polygamists are similar to computer chess. Better computers are with more threads; or a quad with four threads, two quads with eight threads, three quads with twelve threads. There is no maximum for computer chess. So the polygamists?<br />
</span></p>
<p><span style="font-size:10pt;">Try a chess game with a quad using Rybka chess engine, its fun.</span></p>
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<title><![CDATA[Protecting the Church's Identity]]></title>
<link>http://ldsthoughts.wordpress.com/?p=6</link>
<pubDate>Fri, 27 Jun 2008 18:07:00 +0000</pubDate>
<dc:creator>Rebecca</dc:creator>
<guid>http://ldsthoughts.wordpress.com/?p=6</guid>
<description><![CDATA[[Article as shown on LDS Newsroom]
SALT LAKE CITY 26 June 2008 In an effort to reduce misunderstandi]]></description>
<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><span style="color:#808080;">[Article as shown on <a title="LDSNewsroom" href="http://newsroom.lds.org/ldsnewsroom/eng/commentary/protecting-the-church-s-identity" target="_blank">LDS Newsroom</a>]</span></p>
<p><span style="color:#808080;"><span class="byline">SALT LAKE CITY</span></span><span style="color:#808080;"> </span><span style="color:#808080;"><span class="dateline">26 June 2008</span></span> In an effort to reduce misunderstanding among the public and occasional misreporting among the media over the question of polygamy and The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, “<a href="http://newsroom.lds.org/ldsnewsroom/eng/" target="_blank">Newsroom</a>” today is doing something a little different.</p>
<p>The stories and linked materials on this page are designed to help the public — and the news media — draw clear distinctions between the polygamous group associated with the Yearning for Zion ranch in Eldorado, Texas, and <a href="http://www.lds.org/ldsorg/v/index.jsp?vgnextoid=e419fb40e21cef00VgnVCM1000001f5e340aRCRD" target="_blank">The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints</a>. Once again, as it has done many times, The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints reiterates that it has nothing whatsoever to do with any groups practicing polygamy.</p>
<p>This is not an attempt to attack the group that now calls itself the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, but rather an initiative to draw clear distinctions between two very different religious entities. Like all other religions, the FLDS have the right to worship according to the dictates of their conscience, subject to the law.</p>
<p>To illustrate the confusion, a recent poll was conducted in which 36 percent of those surveyed thought the FLDS polygamous group was “part of” The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints and 29 percent said they were not sure. These results show that a sizeable portion of the population cannot tell the difference between the mainstream Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints and the FLDS group.</p>
<p>Moreover, recent analysis of media around the world indicates that more than 15,000 articles were written about this topic between the end of March 2008 and the middle of June 2008. In Texas alone there were nearly a thousand. During the first month and a half, approximately 5 percent of articles accurately reported on the distinction between the two faiths. But between the middle of May and the middle of June, after the Church began to push for more clarity, the media dramatically improved its reporting, with over 60 percent of articles accurately reporting on the distinction.</p>
<p>Despite its rapid growth and increasing social prominence, The Church of Jesus Christ of latter-day Saints remains obscure in many ways to many people. For example, in addition to erroneous associations with the FLDS, some people still confuse the Church with the Amish, the Unification Church and Scientology. In a world of multiple and multiplying religions, it is natural for a busy public to mistake one for another. However, this does not mean that such mistakes should continue to be perpetuated without being challenged. In fact, maintaining the integrity of the Church’s identity requires constant work and attention.</p>
<p>As part of this effort, Elder Lance B. Wickman, Church general counsel and member of the First Quorum of the Seventy, has sent a <a href="http://newsroom.lds.org/ldsnewsroom/eng/news-releases-stories/media-letter" target="_blank">letter</a> to newspaper publishers and editorial staffs across the nation aiming to correct this confusion. This demonstrates the seriousness with which the Church views the situation. Above all, this is a matter of a church being able to define itself. All organizations, including religions, want to be defined by who they <em>are</em> as opposed to who they are <em>not</em>.</p>
<p>In addition to setting the record straight, this package features profiles of ordinary, faithful Latter-day Saints across the state of Texas. Not only do they demonstrate the place Latter-day Saints occupy in mainstream society, but they also show the many good things they quietly go about doing. Perhaps more than anything else, this effort seeks to highlight the fact that Mormons are much like everyone else. Latter-day Saints strive to live happy, productive lives and contribute to the good of the whole by working hard, raising families and helping people in need. They can be found at every level of society — in business and agriculture, education and the sciences, political parties and government, the entertainment industry and news media.</p>
<p>These images of ordinary Latter-day Saints contrast squarely with the now familiar pictures of remote and insular polygamous groups. This contrast may surprise many people who have no tangible sense for the differences. One curious thing is that this false association perpetuates itself in a world of instantaneous information where everyone has unprecedented access to the facts. The only way to sever these associations is to let the Latter-day Saints define themselves by telling their own stories.</p>
<hr /><strong>To visually see the difference:</strong></p>
<p><strong>An LDS Family:</strong></p>
<p><img class="size-medium wp-image-7 alignbottom" style="border:0 solid black;margin:3px 8px;" src="http://ldsthoughts.wordpress.com/files/2008/06/ldsfamily.jpg?w=205" alt="" width="205" height="300" /></p>
<p><img class="alignbottom size-medium wp-image-8" style="border:0 solid black;margin:3px 8px;" src="http://ldsthoughts.wordpress.com/files/2008/06/ldsfamily2.jpg?w=300" alt="" width="300" height="300" /></p>
<p><strong>An FLDS Family:</strong></p>
<p><img class="alignbottom size-medium wp-image-9" style="border:0 solid black;margin:3px 8px;" src="http://ldsthoughts.wordpress.com/files/2008/06/fldsfamily.png?w=300" alt="" width="300" height="212" /></p>
<p><a href="http://ldsthoughts.files.wordpress.com/2008/06/fldsgreen.jpg"><img class="alignbottom size-medium wp-image-10" style="border:0 solid black;margin:3px 8px;" src="http://ldsthoughts.wordpress.com/files/2008/06/fldsgreen.jpg?w=300" alt="" width="300" height="212" /></a></p>
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<title><![CDATA[LDS Church Distance From FLDS]]></title>
<link>http://lobotero.wordpress.com/?p=382</link>
<pubDate>Fri, 27 Jun 2008 06:58:38 +0000</pubDate>
<dc:creator>lobotero</dc:creator>
<guid>http://lobotero.wordpress.com/?p=382</guid>
<description><![CDATA[After recent occurrences and raids, the LDS Church is trying to distance themselves from the polygam]]></description>
<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>After recent occurrences and raids, the LDS Church is trying to distance themselves from the polygamist practices of the FLDS.</p>
<p>As confusion continues worldwide about the connection between the Salt Lake-based LDS Church and the FLDS polygamist group in Texas, LDS officials ramped up their efforts Thursday to clarify that their members have nothing to do with plural marriage.</p>
<p>The frustration that LDS leaders are feeling over the confusion also was detailed in a letter to more than 80 major media outlets nationwide from the church's attorney, and in a public statement from one of its apostles — also an attorney — about the importance of protecting the church's identity.</p>
<p>The two documents were part of a package of videos and statements of clarification posted on the church's Web site at <a href="http://www.lds.org/" target="_blank">www.lds.org</a> in the "newsroom" section.</p>
<p>The letter reminds editors and publishers that the LDS Church has obtained legal registration, trade and service marks for the term "Mormon," among other terms, and asks journalists to refrain from calling the FLDS polygamous group "fundamentalist Mormons."</p>
<p>But at least one religion scholar said trying to enforce such a distinction could be problematic.</p>
<p>"We are confident that you are committed to avoiding misleading statements that cause unwarranted confusion and that may disparage or infringe the intellectual property rights discussed above," says the letter from Elder Lance B. Wickman, who is identified as the church's "general counsel."</p>
<p>Distinguishing the 13 million-member Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints from the few thousand members of the Fundamentalist LDS Church in both Texas and the Utah-Arizona border towns of Hildale and Colorado City has proven to be an ongoing challenge for the LDS Church, which has issued at least three other public statements distancing itself from the FLDS group in recent months.</p>
<p>The survey seeking to determine how widespread public confusion between Latter-day Saints and the FLDS Church shows, according to the LDS Church statement, that:</p>
<p>• More than a third of those surveyed (36 percent) erroneously thought that the Texas compound was part of the LDS Church.</p>
<p>• 6 percent said the two groups were partly related.</p>
<p>• 29 percent correctly said the two groups were not connected at all.</p>
<p>• 29 percent were not sure.</p>
<p>Still, asking media to refrain from using the term "Mormon fundamentalist" could be problematic for the church, according to Jan Shipps, professor emeritus of history and religious studies at Indiana University-Purdue University, who has long researched the LDS Church</p>
<p>The LDS Church banned the practice of polygamy in the late 19th century and excommunicates any of its members who practice it.</p>
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<title><![CDATA[FLDS Child Dehydrated and Malnourished while in State Care]]></title>
<link>http://bedrockof87.wordpress.com/?p=130</link>
<pubDate>Fri, 27 Jun 2008 05:02:36 +0000</pubDate>
<dc:creator>bedrockof87</dc:creator>
<guid>http://bedrockof87.wordpress.com/?p=130</guid>
<description><![CDATA[State of Texas 48, King George 28
48. A two-year old FLDS girl became dehydrated and malnourished wh]]></description>
<content:encoded><![CDATA[<h2><strong><strong><a href="http://bedrockof87.wordpress.com/2008/05/06/state_of_texas_vs_king_george/" target="_blank">State of Texas 48, King George 28</a></strong></strong></h2>
<p>48. A two-year old FLDS girl became dehydrated and malnourished while in state custody.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.nytimes.com/2008/05/29/us/29polygamy.html?partner=rssnyt&#38;emc=rss" target="_blank">As reported by the New York Times</a>, Ruth Fischer faced a distressing sight when she visited her daughter in a hospital:</p>
<blockquote><p>Hannah looked like a little orphan sitting on the couch. Her hair was stringy and she was in a diaper, a pair of dirty socks and a hospital gown.</p></blockquote>
<p>Similar to what happened in the case of two other children (<a href="http://bedrockof87.wordpress.com/2008/06/20/young-flds-kids-who-suffered-in-state-care/" target="_blank">see previous post</a>), in addition to suffering physical health problems, her daughter also became withdrawn.</p>
<p>It seems that CPS was quite efficient at abusing the FLDS children in the short length of time that they had custody of the children...</p>
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<title><![CDATA[Tag Clouds]]></title>
<link>http://savanvleck.wordpress.com/?p=139</link>
<pubDate>Fri, 27 Jun 2008 02:26:25 +0000</pubDate>
<dc:creator>savanvleck</dc:creator>
<guid>http://savanvleck.wordpress.com/?p=139</guid>
<description><![CDATA[


I have discovered the most fun thing. Now granted, it is after 10:00pm, in Indiana, and according]]></description>
<content:encoded><![CDATA[<div></div>
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<p><span lang="EN"><span style="font-size:small;"></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0;"><span>I have discovered the most fun thing. Now granted, it is after 10:00pm, in Indiana, and according to Master Daughter, I am not to be held responsible for any Blog I post after 10:00pm.  Even without any dippers of Jose Cuervo, I can find humor. And, the Tag Cloud thingy I clicked to show on my Blog today is hysterical. </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0;"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0;"><span>Just take random words and put them together. It’s like poetry.  So, I’m reading the tags and just having all kinds of ideas for new Blogs. It’s a font of inspiration.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0;"><span>So, here is a sample of my Tag Clouds:</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0;"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0;"><span>Chicago Chihuahua: Now, are Chihuahua’s different in Chicago than they are in Denver?  I mean, Chihuahua’s in Wyoming have to be black and wear bandanas around their necks. You can’t even buy a pickup truck in Wyoming without proof of black dog ownership.  The Bandana may be a Colorado thing, now that I think of it. Wyomingites don’t want to admit they might have a dog for fun. (No offense, I love Wyoming)</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0;"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0;"><span>FLDS food foolishness: Do I need to type anything here? Maybe something like, food can’t be red: it’s either the mark of the Devil or of blood, so that means you can’t eat apples (unless you get a heathen to peel them) or tomatoes. What about strawberries and watermelon. Is life worth living without strawberries and watermelon?</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0;"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0;"><span>Hone Schooling humor: Gosh, what I could do with this.  Now, all you homeschoolers, I know people who do a fantastic job homeschooling; unfortunately, I know too many people who have no business homeschooling. So, look at yourself and only be offended if you are in the last group and don’t write me nasty letters if you know darn well you are doing an excellent job. But, most of the home schooling parents I met had NO sense of humor. I think I’ll stop there before I say something I’ll regret in the morning and then it will be raining, in Indiana, and I won’t be able to go on and delete it and pretend I didn’t say it and I’ll get hate mail Blogs. </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0;"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0;"><span>Indiana knitting: Perhaps we could repair our infrastructure that way. When it rains in Indiana you get a party line phone line.  It doesn’t take rain to lose power. That happens once a month whether you want it to or not. The water main is the best; it only breaks every other month.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0;"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0;"><span>Polygamy pottery: Is that a coffee pot with eight coffee cups? Could it be a set with one large bowl and eight cereal bowls? Or a tea pot and eight teacups?</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0;"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0;"><span>Wisconsin writing: That would be the hilarious Blog my niece would have. I will try to get her to join the family Blog-a-thon when I’m up there for the next family wedding.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0;"><span>Okay, I’m going to bed now. Hope I don’t hate myself in the morning.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0;"> </p>
<p></span></span></p>
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<title><![CDATA[Service Plans Capable of Breaking up FLDS Church]]></title>
<link>http://bedrockof87.wordpress.com/?p=127</link>
<pubDate>Wed, 25 Jun 2008 03:53:18 +0000</pubDate>
<dc:creator>bedrockof87</dc:creator>
<guid>http://bedrockof87.wordpress.com/?p=127</guid>
<description><![CDATA[











State of Texas 47, King George 28
47. The service plans for the FLDS families were capab]]></description>
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<h2><strong><a href="http://bedrockof87.wordpress.com/2008/05/06/state_of_texas_vs_king_george/" target="_blank">State of Texas 47, King George 28</a></strong></h2>
<p><strong><a href="http://bedrockof87.wordpress.com/2008/05/06/state_of_texas_vs_king_george/" target="_blank"></a>47. The service plans for the FLDS families were capable of breaking apart the FLDS Church in Texas.</strong></p>
<p>The service plans allege that (<a href="http://www.deseretnews.com/pdf/051508_fldsplan.pdf" target="_blank">link to example plan</a>):</p>
<blockquote><p>The adults have chosen to be members of a community that appears to support systemic [sic] abuse of children.... Sexual abuse has been confirmed for some children which poses risk of abuse to all children.</p></blockquote>
<p>And the cover letter states:</p>
<blockquote><p>If the judge is not satisfied that you can provide a safe place for your child where they are free from abuse, the judge may decide to ... permanently take away all of your rights as a parent of the child.</p></blockquote>
<p>It doesn't require an excessive amount of reading between the lines to draw the conclusion that if FLDS parents want to keep their children they should leave Eldorado. The service plan even helps this conclusion along by assigning DFPS (Texas Department of Family and Protective Services) the task to:</p>
<blockquote><p>Assist the parent with finding community and other resources to sustain independent living arrangements.</p></blockquote>
<p>The service plan praises the FLDS community's system of mutual financial support:</p>
<blockquote><p>They have a community financial support structure within the YFZ ranch. They are resourceful by gardening, making clothing and utilizing home-making skills and strong construction skills. The mothers have support from other adult women and adolescent girls who assist with child care responsibilities. The family refrains from drug and alcohol abuse.</p></blockquote>
<p>However, the plan makes it pretty clear that the parents are expected to remove themselves from that financially supportive environment. One of the tasks assigned to the parents in the service plan is to:</p>
<blockquote><p>Participate in educational/vocational testing for yourself, and work on educational or vocational training as needed to be able to financially support your child.</p></blockquote>
<p>Another task assigned to the parents involved budgeting skills. The service plan appears to be saying, "You have a nice financial support structure in your community: now please get out of it."</p>
<p>A law professor and expert on juvenile law quoted by the <a href="http://www.dallasobserver.com/2008-05-22/news/family-planning/" target="_blank">Dallas Observer</a> summed up the service plans well:</p>
<blockquote><p>My understanding of the plans is that they may have to be willing to separate from the larger community and become more of a nuclear family, and maybe even be willing to live outside of the compound. As I understand it, one of the goals is not to punish the parents, but to liberate them from this community and conditions, in which other women have said it is very difficult to leave.</p></blockquote>
<p>After reading through one of the service plans, the main thing I find myself asking is the following: why is there so much mention of budgeting, vocational training, and housing and no mention of not permitting children to marry before the age of consent. Wasn't that supposed to be the problem the state was trying to address?</p>
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<title><![CDATA['Stolen Innocence' book]]></title>
<link>http://headslammer.wordpress.com/?p=63</link>
<pubDate>Wed, 25 Jun 2008 00:24:34 +0000</pubDate>
<dc:creator>headslammer</dc:creator>
<guid>http://headslammer.wordpress.com/?p=63</guid>
<description><![CDATA[     Well here it is that time again where I am sitting down and racking my brain to think of a ]]></description>
<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>     Well here it is that time again where I am sitting down and racking my brain to think of a topic to write about. I know I am in the middle of a story about myself, but I can't feel it right now. I don't want to just throw something up in a post when I know it will suck when it pertains to getting on with my story.</p>
<p>     I usually think all day about what I plan on writing at night. If I am really thinking hard about what to say about my life story, I will plan on how to go about moving it along. I have time at work to think about these things because I ride around in a truck all day from job to job.</p>
<p>     But today, and yesterday, I have been reading a book called 'Stolen Innocence' by Elissa Wall. I found this book at...dare I say...Target when I got bored with my wife's shopping for bedroom decor. Yes I know I wrote about how hard it is for a man to be there. It is! So I wandered to the media section.</p>
<p>     I found this book 'Stolen Innocence' and picked it off the shelf because the cover made me curious. I has this little girl on it, who is wearing a long sleeve dress. She looks like, what I thought, an Amish girl. I was wrong.</p>
<p>     Upon reading the jacket, she is from the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, or FLDS. Apparently she is now grown up and wrote this book about what her life was like living this lifestyle she was born into.</p>
<p>     Then I noticed the pictures in the middle and read the captions under each one of them. Very, very interesting. As I finished, my wife said that she heard this book was very good. So I bought it.</p>
<p>     I have been glued to it ever since. It has taken my mind off my blogging ideas for a while. But obviously I have found some thing to blog about...that book!</p>
<p>     I highly recommend it! It is a good hard look into the lives of these people through the eyes of the author, Elissa Wall. It shows just how faithful they are to their God and to their families and their prophets.</p>
<p>     Amazing that this stuf goes on. If anyone reads this blog and has, or is, reading that book, please drop me a comment. I wanna know what you think.</p>
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<title><![CDATA[FLDS: In need of a Father Figure]]></title>
<link>http://hiscrivener.wordpress.com/?p=218</link>
<pubDate>Mon, 23 Jun 2008 12:02:45 +0000</pubDate>
<dc:creator>hiscrivener</dc:creator>
<guid>http://hiscrivener.wordpress.com/?p=218</guid>
<description><![CDATA[I know, utterly ironic, right?!
The church&#8230; eh, cult known for creating more offspring than a ]]></description>
<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I know, utterly ironic, right?!</p>
<p>The <span style="text-decoration:line-through;">church</span>... eh, cult known for creating more offspring than a pair of rabbits on a deserted island has been orphaned, in a funny sense.</p>
<p>According to <a title="Anyone hear George Michael singing?" href="http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/metropolitan/5850147.html" target="_blank">this story from the <em>Houston Chronicle</em></a>, FLDS has no leader because Jeffs is in lockdown and no one else seems to know how to take the lead of the stained pulpit vacated at YFZ Ranch.</p>
<p>Never fear, just in time for political season, even Warren Jeffs has a 'short list' of candidates for succession. Thank goodness. We now bring you back to the freak show in Eldorado.</p>
<p>BTW, anyone hear George Michael humming in your ear? Well, I suppose that's appropriate considering folk of FLDS need a little "Faith." (ROCK ME!)</p>
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<title><![CDATA[Young FLDS Kids Who Suffered in State Care]]></title>
<link>http://bedrockof87.wordpress.com/?p=125</link>
<pubDate>Sat, 21 Jun 2008 03:40:26 +0000</pubDate>
<dc:creator>bedrockof87</dc:creator>
<guid>http://bedrockof87.wordpress.com/?p=125</guid>
<description><![CDATA[State of Texas 46, King George 28
46. CPS employees admitted in court that Rulon and Amber Jessop fa]]></description>
<content:encoded><![CDATA[<h2><a href="../2008/05/06/state_of_texas_vs_king_george/" target="_blank">State of Texas 46, King George 28</a></h2>
<p><strong>46. CPS employees admitted in court that Rulon and Amber Jessop fared poorly while in state protective custody.</strong></p>
<p>The <a href="http://www.deseretnews.com/article/1,5143,700227803,00.html?pg=4" target="_blank">Deseret News</a> reported that - according to CPS workers - Amber Jessop (age 3) and her younger brother Rulon (age 2) slept poorly, ate poorly, and became withdrawn while in foster care.</p>
<p>Looking at the case of the Jessop children as well as cases I've mentioned in earlier posts (<a href="http://bedrockof87.wordpress.com/2008/06/10/cps-didnt-allow-flds-kid-with-104-degree-fever-to-be-with-mom/" target="_blank">FLDS kid with 104 degree fever not allowed to be with mom</a>; <a href="http://bedrockof87.wordpress.com/2008/05/27/flds-child-crying-himself-to-sleep/" target="_blank">FLDS kid cyring himself to sleep</a>), it appears that CPS did a poor job of risk-reward analysis in determining whether children would be at greater risk remaining in the FLDS community or being moved to foster care.</p>
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<title><![CDATA[Virtual FLDS Petition (Part II)]]></title>
<link>http://bedrockof87.wordpress.com/?p=124</link>
<pubDate>Fri, 20 Jun 2008 05:14:16 +0000</pubDate>
<dc:creator>bedrockof87</dc:creator>
<guid>http://bedrockof87.wordpress.com/?p=124</guid>
<description><![CDATA[Here are some additional links for the Virtual Petition I assembled in a previous post. None of the ]]></description>
<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Here are some additional links for the Virtual Petition I assembled in a <a href="http://bedrockof87.wordpress.com/2008/05/24/virtual-flds-petition/" target="_blank">previous post</a>. None of the below was actually written as a petition (except for the petition of writ of habeus corpus), but all of the below authors expressed significant concerns about the manner in which the FLDS case was handled by Texas, even though some of the below also express distinct reservations about the FLDS.</p>
<p>Please let me know if you have found editorials from other states, to help round out this collection from across the country.</p>
<p>1. <a href="http://www.supreme.courts.state.tx.us/historical/2008/may/080391.htm" target="_blank">Texas Supreme Court Majority Opinion</a> (required reading)<br />
2. <a href="http://www.adrive.com/public/d9ede5e1bb288ddeecc719552fa216e197d5210b535ca75cada2e033fe524d6e.html" target="_blank">Petition for writ of habeus corpus</a> (required reading)<br />
3. Arizona - <a href="http://www.eastvalleytribune.com/story/117190" target="_blank">East Valley Tribune (Phoenix)</a> - This editorial - coming from an editorial board that initially supported the raid - concludes that the raid "appears to have turned into an assault on religious beliefs unpopular with mainstream society."<br />
4. California - <a href="http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/la-ed-polygamists22apr22,0,6803365.story" target="_blank">Los Angeles Times</a> - Though not very sympathetic to the FLDS, this editorial still raises concerns about painting all FLDS with the same brush.<br />
5. Colorado - <a href="http://www.gazette.com/opinion/children_36652___article.html/cps_court.html" target="_blank">The Gazette (Colorado Springs)</a> - This editorial draws the unsettling conclusion that, in the child protective services universe, parents are guilty until proven innocent.<br />
6. Delaware - <a href="http://www.delawareonline.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080524/OPINION11/805240314/1004/OPINION" target="_blank">The News Journal (Wilmington)</a> - And this editorial concludes that "good intentions aren't enough."<br />
7. Florida - <a href="http://www.tampabay.com/opinion/editorials/article522353.ece" target="_blank">St. Petersburg Times</a> - This editorial opines that "a more measured response would have allowed the state to protect the girls who are in danger" and complains about the cruelty of removing all the children from their families.<br />
8. Georgia - <a href="http://chronicle.augusta.com/stories/052408/edi_399140.shtml" target="_blank">Augusta Times</a> - Proclaiming that "This is still America. And the government's power to ... remove children from their homes must necessarily be strictly contained," this editorial proceeds to a cleverly-stated conclusion.<br />
9. Maine - <a href="http://kennebecjournal.mainetoday.com/view/columns/5089921.html" target="_blank">Kennebec Journal</a> - This editorial argues that "We live in a country of laws. And no matter how distasteful ... the practices alleged to take place at the polygamist sect's ranch in Texas may be, the law protects even the most despicable among us."<br />
10. New York - <a href="http://www.forward.com/articles/13462/" target="_blank">The Jewish Daily Forward</a> - This editorial addresses the concern that the religion was being punished, stating, "In America, we punish conduct, not belief systems."<br />
11. Oregon - <a href="http://www.statesmanjournal.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080428/OPINION/804280316/1049/OPINION" target="_blank">Statesman Journal (Mid-Willamette Valley)</a> - This editorial asks, "What protections do we have when the state can enter our homes en masse and break up our families based upon false allegations of abuse by an imposter?"<br />
12. Texas - <a href="http://www.timesrecordnews.com/news/2008/may/25/our-opinion-jumped-gun/?printer=1/" target="_blank">Times Record News (Wichita Falls)</a> - This editorial concludes that "much heartache and expense could have been avoided" if the state had exercised more caution from the start.<br />
13. Utah - <a href="http://origin.sltrib.com/ci_9363255" target="_blank">The Salt Lake Tribune</a> - Another editorial with a great punchline at the end.<br />
14. Washington - <a href="http://www.columbian.com/opinion/news/2008/06/06052008_Pulling-apart-families-only-creates-harm.cfm" target="_blank">The Columbian (Vancouver) </a>- An editorial with a harsh condemnation of the FLDS but which still weighs in on the side of investigating before intervening.<br />
15. Washington, D.C. - <a href="http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/06/05/AR2008060503489.html" target="_blank">Washington Post</a> - In spite of significant concerns about the FLDS, this editorial concludes that officials initially overreacted.</p>
<p>It seems that you don't have to be a fan of the FLDS to conclude that the FLDS were not treated lawfully.</p>
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<title><![CDATA["We're Not Going to Violate Their Civil Rights until We Get an Outcry"]]></title>
<link>http://bedrockof87.wordpress.com/?p=122</link>
<pubDate>Thu, 19 Jun 2008 03:31:41 +0000</pubDate>
<dc:creator>bedrockof87</dc:creator>
<guid>http://bedrockof87.wordpress.com/?p=122</guid>
<description><![CDATA[State of Texas 45, King George 28
45. In what has to be one of the most notable quotes of the Eldora]]></description>
<content:encoded><![CDATA[<h2><a href="../2008/05/06/state_of_texas_vs_king_george/" target="_blank">State of Texas 45, King George 28</a></h2>
<p><strong>45. In what has to be one of the most notable quotes of the Eldorado fiasco, the Schleicher County Sheriff said, "This is the United States.... We're not going to violate their civil rights until we get an outcry."</strong></p>
<p>Here's a little more context for the quote, as reported by the <a href="http://www.tucsoncitizen.com/ss/byauthor/82330" target="_blank">Tucson Citizen</a>:</p>
<blockquote><p>I have no regrets because we never received any outcry, a complaint. There was no evidence of illegal activity nor an offense in plain view. You can always suspect something, but until you get something that puts you on that property, there's not a whole lot you can do.... But there again, this is the United States. We are going to respect them. We're not going to violate their civil rights until we get an outcry.</p></blockquote>
<p>If he had said, "We're not going to move against the FLDS until we have evidence" or "We're not going to ask for a search warrant until we have a credible complaint," I would have been right with him.  Or even if he had said, "You cannot go in and bust in someone's house if there's not probable cause to do so," as the Texas attorney general said, I can still see the imprint of the constitution in such a statement. But, if you take the Sheriff's quote literally, he's essentially saying that after there's an outcry or a complaint, it's OK to violate civil rights. I can only hope that comment didn't come out the way he intended.</p>
<p>The sheriff's statement, even in the form it came out, is not as scary as some of the comments about his statement. I have found multiple posts on the internet by people complaining that the sheriff felt constrained to wait for an outcry. These sentiments remind me of Lincoln's great speech at the Young Men's Lyceum in which he addressed the subject of "the perpetuation of our political institutions".</p>
<blockquote><p>When men take it in their heads today to hang gamblers or burn murderers, they should recollect that in the confusion usually attending such transactions they will be as likely to hang or burn someone who is neither a gambler nor a murderer as one who is, and that, acting upon the example they set, the mob of tomorrow may, and probably will, hang or burn some of them by the very same mistake. And not only so; the innocent, those who have ever set their faces against violations of law in every shape, alike with the guilty fall victims to the ravages of mob law; and thus it goes up, step by step, till all the walls erected for the defense of the persons and property of individuals are trodden down and disregarded.</p>
<p>But all this, even, is not the full extent of the evil. By such examples, by instances of the perpetrators of such acts going unpunished, the lawless in spirit are encouraged to become lawless in practice; and having been used to no restraint but dread of punishment, they thus become absolutely unrestrained. Having ever regarded government as their deadliest bane, they make a jubilee of the suspension of its operations, and pray for nothing so much as its total annihilation.</p>
<p>While, on the other hand, good men, men who love tranquility, who desire to abide by the laws and enjoy their benefits, who would gladly spill their blood in the defense of their country, seeing their property destroyed, their families insulted, and their lives endangered, their persons injured, and seeing nothing in prospect that forebodes a change for the better, become tired of and disgusted with a government that offers them no protection, and are not much averse to a change in which they imagine they have nothing to lose. Thus, then, by the operation of this mobocratic spirit which all must admit is now abroad in the land, the strongest bulwark of any government, and particularly of those constituted like ours, may effectually be broken down and destroyed-I mean the attachment of the people....</p>
<p>I know the American people are much attached to their government; I know they would suffer much for its sake; I know they would endure evils long and patiently before they would ever think of exchanging it for another-yet, notwithstanding all this, if the laws be continually despised and disregarded, if their rights to be secure in their persons and property are held by no better tenure than the caprice of a mob, the alienation of their affections from the government is the natural consequence; and to that, sooner or later, it must come.</p></blockquote>
<p>Yes, those who don't want the government to wait for an outcry are justified in expecting that the FLDS honor the laws, but we must also insist that the government honor its own laws. Otherwise, if it becomes popular for the government to move against unpopular groups without being restrained by law or constitution, we will be reduced to government-sponsored mobocracy, which - as Lincoln reminded us - in only a step away from anarchy.</p>
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